'Aurith Gods Random Box'

Riku · Jun 29th 2018

Quote from Vitae

Quote from Riku

Quote from Vitae

Quote from Riku

Quote from Vitae

Heres a better one
Imagine waking up in the morning going on the forums to mindlessly defend a company screwing its community over every single week.
Do you think you're special or going to get praise from them?
Of course you aren't because just like everyone else in this community, you're as insignificant as an ant to gameforge

actually i don't think they screw up the community that badly, beside the outfit is expensive the rest of the item is so cheap + don't really think we need that wings it's not really a necessity, it's more like a extra bonus thing (just like any outfit). Even in KR i am sure those wings are rng, maybe outfit may be RNG too or Free idk? someone have to check in KR, i know for sure TW also has RNG boxes and i think i remember seeing JP server also have RNG boxes. The only thing might screw up is that the box has a lot anti destruction, so WUC might go up a little. In other server rng boxes, might not be this outfit rng box, but they have WUC in it. Like i don't think this rng influence people gameplay all that much. Maybe now f2p have one less outfit to get or have to pay a lot for the outfit piece.

They aren't screwing the community over?
Okay putting the Lootboxes aside what about the market inflation
threea actually responded to it (technically) but not the issue directly, only Gold bots (Which they are clearly not coming up with good enough ideas)
They didn't respond to any of the other issues of the communities such as the availability of anti's and WUCs, they targetted gold sellers
Why?
Simple, because it hurts their wallet, they need that third party system out of their game so they can make all the profit off of people by selling SC.
They wouldn't dare make anti's more available because once again, its a premium item so it would hurt their wallet
and WUCs they just don't care about the quality of life in the game enough to bother addressing it.

To put it short, they listen to issues that mutually hurt their wallet and the community in some way, if it only hurts the community but not them, they will not ever dare address it because they have the childish mentality of "if it doesn't hurt me it's fine"

also the only way they tackled anti's availability was exactly how you said, making them available in these rediculous boxes

Display More
well putting the RNG boxes aside, does the boxes create botter? No, u see, the boxes is not the problem, the problem is they have to do something about the botter. Botter and the RNG box is kinda two separate thing. Just that the rng box without WUC will jack up the WUC price, and then having botter which is separate thing (is making the outfit cost a lot of DZ since DZ is worthless due to Botter). And then lets say now we put botter aside if this server has no botter and has no inflation, People that can't get wings still goin to complain about the box is shit. Because it's normal, when ppl gamble and lose they wanna find blame, especially in game it's easy to blame publisher being shit to released this box. But isn't the box is the same as the example i use, you go in to casino and gamble, just because ur friend won in a few hands and got few thousands dollars from it, u can't expect to go in and has the same odds are your friend. Saying both of u might be playing BlackJacks, the probability of winning is the same goes for every player, 52 cards and so on. But just because ur friend is luck and won thousands in 20 games, u cant expect to go in play 20 games and will guarantee win money. So at the end, Botter situation like i said GF need to do something about it. This RNG Box, it's up to players wanna gamble or wait to buy from players. Yes the price is overprice now since botter inflated the market, but botter inflated the market doesnt cause by this rng box.

Display More
The whole response was if gameforge are screwing their community or not.
Not if Lootboxes and Bots are one in the same issue, ofc they're not or not.
But to sit there and blatantly defend the people not listening to their community is honestly just you begging to get bent over more by gameforge, be my guest bc I know there's a community that does listen to one another
*cough* Private server *cough*

Display More

Well but they can't pay their worker without making profit, the community doesn't give them money to paid their worker salary. I think that's why it's hard for most publisher, if their game is start not making profit and they still have all the overhead they have to pay and the contract they are tie in to, they need to do something to let ppl spend. Of course, Private server can give u everything u want and everything u need. Because it's more like a hobby of a group of players or people that try to create a server to make money "cough" i mean Donation. They dont have contract or any law abide to them nor they have that much overhead to take care of. As long as giving u what u want, u willing to donate that's all it matters to them. and worse case, if nobody donate and they dont make profit, they can closed down the server any time they want without worry about contract and other employee salary and so on. Why other game like blizzard, Square Enix and so on have the power to listen to the community? look at Final fantasy they completely make over the game, because they have a lot of capital and money, and they dont mind losing a few hundreds thousands here and there, because they have other product that makes them money. At the end In my opinion, RNG boxes doesnt screw up anything, just that the community jealous that other ppl odds is better than them, just like going into casino example. And they cant take the unfair treatment because they believe this is game, it's publisher job to make sure everything is fair, then who is fair to publisher when they cant paid their overhead and salary? is the F2P players that give feedback and complain goin to come in and help publisher pay for all those thing?

Vitae · Jun 29th 2018

Quote from Riku

Quote from Vitae

Quote from Riku

Quote from Vitae

Quote from Riku

actually i don't think they screw up the community that badly, beside the outfit is expensive the rest of the item is so cheap + don't really think we need that wings it's not really a necessity, it's more like a extra bonus thing (just like any outfit). Even in KR i am sure those wings are rng, maybe outfit may be RNG too or Free idk? someone have to check in KR, i know for sure TW also has RNG boxes and i think i remember seeing JP server also have RNG boxes. The only thing might screw up is that the box has a lot anti destruction, so WUC might go up a little. In other server rng boxes, might not be this outfit rng box, but they have WUC in it. Like i don't think this rng influence people gameplay all that much. Maybe now f2p have one less outfit to get or have to pay a lot for the outfit piece.

They aren't screwing the community over?
Okay putting the Lootboxes aside what about the market inflation
threea actually responded to it (technically) but not the issue directly, only Gold bots (Which they are clearly not coming up with good enough ideas)
They didn't respond to any of the other issues of the communities such as the availability of anti's and WUCs, they targetted gold sellers
Why?
Simple, because it hurts their wallet, they need that third party system out of their game so they can make all the profit off of people by selling SC.
They wouldn't dare make anti's more available because once again, its a premium item so it would hurt their wallet
and WUCs they just don't care about the quality of life in the game enough to bother addressing it.

To put it short, they listen to issues that mutually hurt their wallet and the community in some way, if it only hurts the community but not them, they will not ever dare address it because they have the childish mentality of "if it doesn't hurt me it's fine"

also the only way they tackled anti's availability was exactly how you said, making them available in these rediculous boxes

Display More
well putting the RNG boxes aside, does the boxes create botter? No, u see, the boxes is not the problem, the problem is they have to do something about the botter. Botter and the RNG box is kinda two separate thing. Just that the rng box without WUC will jack up the WUC price, and then having botter which is separate thing (is making the outfit cost a lot of DZ since DZ is worthless due to Botter). And then lets say now we put botter aside if this server has no botter and has no inflation, People that can't get wings still goin to complain about the box is shit. Because it's normal, when ppl gamble and lose they wanna find blame, especially in game it's easy to blame publisher being shit to released this box. But isn't the box is the same as the example i use, you go in to casino and gamble, just because ur friend won in a few hands and got few thousands dollars from it, u can't expect to go in and has the same odds are your friend. Saying both of u might be playing BlackJacks, the probability of winning is the same goes for every player, 52 cards and so on. But just because ur friend is luck and won thousands in 20 games, u cant expect to go in play 20 games and will guarantee win money. So at the end, Botter situation like i said GF need to do something about it. This RNG Box, it's up to players wanna gamble or wait to buy from players. Yes the price is overprice now since botter inflated the market, but botter inflated the market doesnt cause by this rng box.

Display More
The whole response was if gameforge are screwing their community or not.
Not if Lootboxes and Bots are one in the same issue, ofc they're not or not.
But to sit there and blatantly defend the people not listening to their community is honestly just you begging to get bent over more by gameforge, be my guest bc I know there's a community that does listen to one another
*cough* Private server *cough*

Display More
Well but they can't pay their worker without making profit, the community doesn't give them money to paid their worker salary. I think that's why it's hard for most publisher, if their game is start not making profit and they still have all the overhead they have to pay and the contract they are tie in to, they need to do something to let ppl spend. Of course, Private server can give u everything u want and everything u need. Because it's more like a hobby of a group of players or people that try to create a server to make money "cough" i mean Donation. They dont have contract or any law abide to them nor they have that much overhead to take care of. As long as giving u what u want, u willing to donate that's all it matters to them. and worse case, if nobody donate and they dont make profit, they can closed down the server any time they want without worry about contract and other employee salary and so on. Why other game like blizzard, Square Enix and so on have the power to listen to the community? look at Final fantasy they completely make over the game, because they have a lot of capital and money, and they dont mind losing a few hundreds thousands here and there, because they have other product that makes them money. At the end In my opinion, RNG boxes doesnt screw up anything, just that the community jealous that other ppl odds is better than them, just like going into casino example. And they cant take the unfair treatment because they believe this is game, it's publisher job to make sure everything is fair, then who is fair to publisher when they cant paid their overhead and salary? is the F2P players that give feedback and complain goin to come in and help publisher pay for all those thing?

Display More

So you think it's hard for the publishers...
The people who have ultimate control over how content is distributed. Of course this case is a little special because Liongames has a specific timeline they're keeping to and they also develop the game. But the method of how content is given is seperate to when the content is released, heck if gameforge wanted they could most likely DLC lock characters, as long as Liongames approve.
But seriously dude, read up about gameforge, they have ported many games in the past and killed almost every single one of them. This game will be no exception

Riku · Jun 29th 2018

Quote from Vitae

Quote from Riku

Quote from Vitae

Quote from Riku

Quote from Vitae

They aren't screwing the community over?
Okay putting the Lootboxes aside what about the market inflation
threea actually responded to it (technically) but not the issue directly, only Gold bots (Which they are clearly not coming up with good enough ideas)
They didn't respond to any of the other issues of the communities such as the availability of anti's and WUCs, they targetted gold sellers
Why?
Simple, because it hurts their wallet, they need that third party system out of their game so they can make all the profit off of people by selling SC.
They wouldn't dare make anti's more available because once again, its a premium item so it would hurt their wallet
and WUCs they just don't care about the quality of life in the game enough to bother addressing it.

To put it short, they listen to issues that mutually hurt their wallet and the community in some way, if it only hurts the community but not them, they will not ever dare address it because they have the childish mentality of "if it doesn't hurt me it's fine"

also the only way they tackled anti's availability was exactly how you said, making them available in these rediculous boxes

Display More
well putting the RNG boxes aside, does the boxes create botter? No, u see, the boxes is not the problem, the problem is they have to do something about the botter. Botter and the RNG box is kinda two separate thing. Just that the rng box without WUC will jack up the WUC price, and then having botter which is separate thing (is making the outfit cost a lot of DZ since DZ is worthless due to Botter). And then lets say now we put botter aside if this server has no botter and has no inflation, People that can't get wings still goin to complain about the box is shit. Because it's normal, when ppl gamble and lose they wanna find blame, especially in game it's easy to blame publisher being shit to released this box. But isn't the box is the same as the example i use, you go in to casino and gamble, just because ur friend won in a few hands and got few thousands dollars from it, u can't expect to go in and has the same odds are your friend. Saying both of u might be playing BlackJacks, the probability of winning is the same goes for every player, 52 cards and so on. But just because ur friend is luck and won thousands in 20 games, u cant expect to go in play 20 games and will guarantee win money. So at the end, Botter situation like i said GF need to do something about it. This RNG Box, it's up to players wanna gamble or wait to buy from players. Yes the price is overprice now since botter inflated the market, but botter inflated the market doesnt cause by this rng box.

Display More
The whole response was if gameforge are screwing their community or not.
Not if Lootboxes and Bots are one in the same issue, ofc they're not or not.
But to sit there and blatantly defend the people not listening to their community is honestly just you begging to get bent over more by gameforge, be my guest bc I know there's a community that does listen to one another
*cough* Private server *cough*

Display More
Well but they can't pay their worker without making profit, the community doesn't give them money to paid their worker salary. I think that's why it's hard for most publisher, if their game is start not making profit and they still have all the overhead they have to pay and the contract they are tie in to, they need to do something to let ppl spend. Of course, Private server can give u everything u want and everything u need. Because it's more like a hobby of a group of players or people that try to create a server to make money "cough" i mean Donation. They dont have contract or any law abide to them nor they have that much overhead to take care of. As long as giving u what u want, u willing to donate that's all it matters to them. and worse case, if nobody donate and they dont make profit, they can closed down the server any time they want without worry about contract and other employee salary and so on. Why other game like blizzard, Square Enix and so on have the power to listen to the community? look at Final fantasy they completely make over the game, because they have a lot of capital and money, and they dont mind losing a few hundreds thousands here and there, because they have other product that makes them money. At the end In my opinion, RNG boxes doesnt screw up anything, just that the community jealous that other ppl odds is better than them, just like going into casino example. And they cant take the unfair treatment because they believe this is game, it's publisher job to make sure everything is fair, then who is fair to publisher when they cant paid their overhead and salary? is the F2P players that give feedback and complain goin to come in and help publisher pay for all those thing?

Display More
So you think it's hard for the publishers...
The people who have ultimate control over how content is distributed. Of course this case is a little special because Liongames has a specific timeline they're keeping to and they also develop the game. But the method of how content is given is seperate to when the content is released, heck if gameforge wanted they could most likely DLC lock characters, as long as Liongames approve.
But seriously dude, read up about gameforge, they have ported many games in the past and killed almost every single one of them. This game will be no exception

Display More

Well and you see, check all the update/news date, they been constantly releasing content every 2-3 weeks. Yes some of content might not be what majority people want, but they need to balance between the patch and find the right time to release each patch and how to profit the most. If they released Primal And iris, hardcore gamer still got to end game fast and complain no end game. Then where their profit is? that's why they release maybe the content majority player doesnt want, but there is no other content for them anymore as of now, so if they stay the way they are right now, released new content every two weeks. That means July 4th it will be either Iris, Primal or Both. And they did said it on Twitter please be patience, and it's less than 2 weeks people are saying GF not doin what community want. Isn't it's the people that is being very impatience? if this is KR server, you wouldnt know what u will get in the future patch, will u still be this impatience? KR didnt even get their patch that fast, but ppl expect GF to do it without thinking about their profit, just released all content now and once we done with the end game we will leave. Ur company profit? that is not my concern that for you to figure out urself, we are the community and we are the king. Listen to us that's what majority want. Isn't that's kinda unfair for GF then?

i am not protecting GF or anything, the fact that they still didnt deal with Botter that is something they truly need to work on it. But i really see them constantly release content every 2-3 weeks, just not what majority people want. But some minority is enjoying housing and some are still catching up to the game. (and you have to realized this game released in KR January 18, 2017 and in JP it's April, 2016. JP that is 2 years and KR a year and a half, and it released in NA server Feb 26th, 2018, and you pretty much expect GF to catch up everything in less than 3-4 months. While other server probably make more money and wait longer than us.)

Vitae · Jun 30th 2018

Quote from Riku

Quote from Vitae

Quote from Riku

Quote from Vitae

Quote from Riku

well putting the RNG boxes aside, does the boxes create botter? No, u see, the boxes is not the problem, the problem is they have to do something about the botter. Botter and the RNG box is kinda two separate thing. Just that the rng box without WUC will jack up the WUC price, and then having botter which is separate thing (is making the outfit cost a lot of DZ since DZ is worthless due to Botter). And then lets say now we put botter aside if this server has no botter and has no inflation, People that can't get wings still goin to complain about the box is shit. Because it's normal, when ppl gamble and lose they wanna find blame, especially in game it's easy to blame publisher being shit to released this box. But isn't the box is the same as the example i use, you go in to casino and gamble, just because ur friend won in a few hands and got few thousands dollars from it, u can't expect to go in and has the same odds are your friend. Saying both of u might be playing BlackJacks, the probability of winning is the same goes for every player, 52 cards and so on. But just because ur friend is luck and won thousands in 20 games, u cant expect to go in play 20 games and will guarantee win money. So at the end, Botter situation like i said GF need to do something about it. This RNG Box, it's up to players wanna gamble or wait to buy from players. Yes the price is overprice now since botter inflated the market, but botter inflated the market doesnt cause by this rng box.

The whole response was if gameforge are screwing their community or not.
Not if Lootboxes and Bots are one in the same issue, ofc they're not or not.
But to sit there and blatantly defend the people not listening to their community is honestly just you begging to get bent over more by gameforge, be my guest bc I know there's a community that does listen to one another
*cough* Private server *cough*

Well but they can't pay their worker without making profit, the community doesn't give them money to paid their worker salary. I think that's why it's hard for most publisher, if their game is start not making profit and they still have all the overhead they have to pay and the contract they are tie in to, they need to do something to let ppl spend. Of course, Private server can give u everything u want and everything u need. Because it's more like a hobby of a group of players or people that try to create a server to make money "cough" i mean Donation. They dont have contract or any law abide to them nor they have that much overhead to take care of. As long as giving u what u want, u willing to donate that's all it matters to them. and worse case, if nobody donate and they dont make profit, they can closed down the server any time they want without worry about contract and other employee salary and so on. Why other game like blizzard, Square Enix and so on have the power to listen to the community? look at Final fantasy they completely make over the game, because they have a lot of capital and money, and they dont mind losing a few hundreds thousands here and there, because they have other product that makes them money. At the end In my opinion, RNG boxes doesnt screw up anything, just that the community jealous that other ppl odds is better than them, just like going into casino example. And they cant take the unfair treatment because they believe this is game, it's publisher job to make sure everything is fair, then who is fair to publisher when they cant paid their overhead and salary? is the F2P players that give feedback and complain goin to come in and help publisher pay for all those thing?

So you think it's hard for the publishers...
The people who have ultimate control over how content is distributed. Of course this case is a little special because Liongames has a specific timeline they're keeping to and they also develop the game. But the method of how content is given is seperate to when the content is released, heck if gameforge wanted they could most likely DLC lock characters, as long as Liongames approve.
But seriously dude, read up about gameforge, they have ported many games in the past and killed almost every single one of them. This game will be no exception

Well and you see, check all the update/news date, they been constantly releasing content every 2-3 weeks. Yes some of content might not be what majority people want, but they need to balance between the patch and find the right time to release each patch and how to profit the most. If they released Primal And iris, hardcore gamer still got to end game fast and complain no end game. Then where their profit is? that's why they release maybe the content majority player doesnt want, but there is no other content for them anymore as of now, so if they stay the way they are right now, released new content every two weeks. That means July 4th it will be either Iris, Primal or Both. And they did said it on Twitter please be patience, and it's less than 2 weeks people are saying GF not doin what community want. Isn't it's the people that is being very impatience? if this is KR server, you wouldnt know what u will get in the future patch, will u still be this impatience? KR didnt even get their patch that fast, but ppl expect GF to do it without thinking about their profit, just released all content now and once we done with the end game we will leave. Ur company profit? that is not my concern that for you to figure out urself, we are the community and we are the king. Listen to us that's what majority want. Isn't that's kinda unfair for GF then?

i am not protecting GF or anything, the fact that they still didnt deal with Botter that is something they truly need to work on it. But i really see them constantly release content every 2-3 weeks, just not what majority people want. But some minority is enjoying housing and some are still catching up to the game. (and you have to realized this game released in KR January 18, 2017 and in JP it's April, 2016. JP that is 2 years and KR a year and a half, and it released in NA server Feb 26th, 2018, and you pretty much expect GF to catch up everything in less than 3-4 months. While other server probably make more money and wait longer than us.)

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I expect gameforge to catch up?
Well yes considering practically ALL of the content they get is handed to them from LionGames
you forget who are the main developers of the game don't you.
Also you're basically saying infuriating the community and making them hate you is the best way to keep people involved. People who just want to play their damn character...
Do you really think people who want to main an unreleased character are going to spend money on a different character, of course not.
The only things recently have been pointless patches and outfits. It's not even as if it fixes gamebreaking bugs or crashes or anything of the sort.
It's complete minimal effort garbage

Riku · Jun 30th 2018

Quote from Vitae

Quote from Riku

Quote from Vitae

Quote from Riku

Quote from Vitae

The whole response was if gameforge are screwing their community or not.
Not if Lootboxes and Bots are one in the same issue, ofc they're not or not.
But to sit there and blatantly defend the people not listening to their community is honestly just you begging to get bent over more by gameforge, be my guest bc I know there's a community that does listen to one another
*cough* Private server *cough*

Well but they can't pay their worker without making profit, the community doesn't give them money to paid their worker salary. I think that's why it's hard for most publisher, if their game is start not making profit and they still have all the overhead they have to pay and the contract they are tie in to, they need to do something to let ppl spend. Of course, Private server can give u everything u want and everything u need. Because it's more like a hobby of a group of players or people that try to create a server to make money "cough" i mean Donation. They dont have contract or any law abide to them nor they have that much overhead to take care of. As long as giving u what u want, u willing to donate that's all it matters to them. and worse case, if nobody donate and they dont make profit, they can closed down the server any time they want without worry about contract and other employee salary and so on. Why other game like blizzard, Square Enix and so on have the power to listen to the community? look at Final fantasy they completely make over the game, because they have a lot of capital and money, and they dont mind losing a few hundreds thousands here and there, because they have other product that makes them money. At the end In my opinion, RNG boxes doesnt screw up anything, just that the community jealous that other ppl odds is better than them, just like going into casino example. And they cant take the unfair treatment because they believe this is game, it's publisher job to make sure everything is fair, then who is fair to publisher when they cant paid their overhead and salary? is the F2P players that give feedback and complain goin to come in and help publisher pay for all those thing?

So you think it's hard for the publishers...
The people who have ultimate control over how content is distributed. Of course this case is a little special because Liongames has a specific timeline they're keeping to and they also develop the game. But the method of how content is given is seperate to when the content is released, heck if gameforge wanted they could most likely DLC lock characters, as long as Liongames approve.
But seriously dude, read up about gameforge, they have ported many games in the past and killed almost every single one of them. This game will be no exception

Well and you see, check all the update/news date, they been constantly releasing content every 2-3 weeks. Yes some of content might not be what majority people want, but they need to balance between the patch and find the right time to release each patch and how to profit the most. If they released Primal And iris, hardcore gamer still got to end game fast and complain no end game. Then where their profit is? that's why they release maybe the content majority player doesnt want, but there is no other content for them anymore as of now, so if they stay the way they are right now, released new content every two weeks. That means July 4th it will be either Iris, Primal or Both. And they did said it on Twitter please be patience, and it's less than 2 weeks people are saying GF not doin what community want. Isn't it's the people that is being very impatience? if this is KR server, you wouldnt know what u will get in the future patch, will u still be this impatience? KR didnt even get their patch that fast, but ppl expect GF to do it without thinking about their profit, just released all content now and once we done with the end game we will leave. Ur company profit? that is not my concern that for you to figure out urself, we are the community and we are the king. Listen to us that's what majority want. Isn't that's kinda unfair for GF then?

i am not protecting GF or anything, the fact that they still didnt deal with Botter that is something they truly need to work on it. But i really see them constantly release content every 2-3 weeks, just not what majority people want. But some minority is enjoying housing and some are still catching up to the game. (and you have to realized this game released in KR January 18, 2017 and in JP it's April, 2016. JP that is 2 years and KR a year and a half, and it released in NA server Feb 26th, 2018, and you pretty much expect GF to catch up everything in less than 3-4 months. While other server probably make more money and wait longer than us.)

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I expect gameforge to catch up?
Well yes considering practically ALL of the content they get is handed to them from LionGames
you forget who are the main developers of the game don't you.
Also you're basically saying infuriating the community and making them hate you is the best way to keep people involved. People who just want to play their damn character...
Do you really think people who want to main an unreleased character are going to spend money on a different character, of course not.
The only things recently have been pointless patches and outfits. It's not even as if it fixes gamebreaking bugs or crashes or anything of the sort.
It's complete minimal effort garbage

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Aurith set can be use by all character, all they need to prepare aurith set and wait for Iris released then get the weapon for iris. They have so many thing they can prepare right now. All content they get handed to them from LionGames? isn't JP is the same? but JP is released 2 years. Right now it's more like people being impatience since they already knew all the content! and they want GF to instantly released it, isnt' that is the case? May 31, 2018 Jin Advacement release in KR, and Iris Advancement not goin to release until end of July. It takes 2 months for KR to released Content, it takes us 2 weeks, yes it may not be the content majority like, doesnt mean that content shouldnt be release, just because u don't like it doesnt mean others is not waiting for housing. you give GF 2 years of time same as other server then, when other server also got content from Liongate. Then if GF didnt catch up to where other server is, then you can blame GF for everything then.

You think people that complain about no end game content, once GF released Primal and Iris they will be happy? and they wouldn't complain anymore? no, they will beat that shit in 3-4 weeks and EC all pieces stat, then complain no content, alter of void please. Bcoz they know the future content, so they dont want to be patience they want it as soon as they got their gears. People hating gameforge because they know all the future content, and they can't be patience. not even to wait every 2 weeks to see what content released. And u got KR takes 2 months to another new content, and ppl cant wait for 2 weeks.

_Mrcl · Jun 30th 2018

Just look at Closers, it's going so well and getting new content fast and from what I can see they interact with the community and care about feedback. The completely opposite from what is happening here.

Also they're removing the fatigue system.

Riku · Jun 30th 2018

Quote from _Mrcl

Just look at Closers, it's going so well and getting new content fast and from what I can see they interact with the community and care about feedback. The completely opposite from what is happening here.

Also they're removing the fatigue system.

Yes closers did a perfect job, but KR closers is dead bcoz of some kind of screw up the company do. So yeah the publisher did a good job but the developer didnt do well in KR, Which is why all the sudden KR SW become alive again. KR SW almost closed down at one point. So of course, at the end i am not saying GF is doing the best, GF is doing alright and still can be better and improve. Especially on communicating to community part, but i have a feeling even if they did, the amount of complain and whine wouldn't help them in long term. People will find a way to complain or whine in a way, I am sure in Closers there will be some white and complain here and there too. Can't never satisfied everyone.

Vitae · Jun 30th 2018

Quote from Riku

Quote from Vitae

Quote from Riku

Quote from Vitae

Quote from Riku

Well but they can't pay their worker without making profit, the community doesn't give them money to paid their worker salary. I think that's why it's hard for most publisher, if their game is start not making profit and they still have all the overhead they have to pay and the contract they are tie in to, they need to do something to let ppl spend. Of course, Private server can give u everything u want and everything u need. Because it's more like a hobby of a group of players or people that try to create a server to make money "cough" i mean Donation. They dont have contract or any law abide to them nor they have that much overhead to take care of. As long as giving u what u want, u willing to donate that's all it matters to them. and worse case, if nobody donate and they dont make profit, they can closed down the server any time they want without worry about contract and other employee salary and so on. Why other game like blizzard, Square Enix and so on have the power to listen to the community? look at Final fantasy they completely make over the game, because they have a lot of capital and money, and they dont mind losing a few hundreds thousands here and there, because they have other product that makes them money. At the end In my opinion, RNG boxes doesnt screw up anything, just that the community jealous that other ppl odds is better than them, just like going into casino example. And they cant take the unfair treatment because they believe this is game, it's publisher job to make sure everything is fair, then who is fair to publisher when they cant paid their overhead and salary? is the F2P players that give feedback and complain goin to come in and help publisher pay for all those thing?

So you think it's hard for the publishers...
The people who have ultimate control over how content is distributed. Of course this case is a little special because Liongames has a specific timeline they're keeping to and they also develop the game. But the method of how content is given is seperate to when the content is released, heck if gameforge wanted they could most likely DLC lock characters, as long as Liongames approve.
But seriously dude, read up about gameforge, they have ported many games in the past and killed almost every single one of them. This game will be no exception

Well and you see, check all the update/news date, they been constantly releasing content every 2-3 weeks. Yes some of content might not be what majority people want, but they need to balance between the patch and find the right time to release each patch and how to profit the most. If they released Primal And iris, hardcore gamer still got to end game fast and complain no end game. Then where their profit is? that's why they release maybe the content majority player doesnt want, but there is no other content for them anymore as of now, so if they stay the way they are right now, released new content every two weeks. That means July 4th it will be either Iris, Primal or Both. And they did said it on Twitter please be patience, and it's less than 2 weeks people are saying GF not doin what community want. Isn't it's the people that is being very impatience? if this is KR server, you wouldnt know what u will get in the future patch, will u still be this impatience? KR didnt even get their patch that fast, but ppl expect GF to do it without thinking about their profit, just released all content now and once we done with the end game we will leave. Ur company profit? that is not my concern that for you to figure out urself, we are the community and we are the king. Listen to us that's what majority want. Isn't that's kinda unfair for GF then?

i am not protecting GF or anything, the fact that they still didnt deal with Botter that is something they truly need to work on it. But i really see them constantly release content every 2-3 weeks, just not what majority people want. But some minority is enjoying housing and some are still catching up to the game. (and you have to realized this game released in KR January 18, 2017 and in JP it's April, 2016. JP that is 2 years and KR a year and a half, and it released in NA server Feb 26th, 2018, and you pretty much expect GF to catch up everything in less than 3-4 months. While other server probably make more money and wait longer than us.)

I expect gameforge to catch up?
Well yes considering practically ALL of the content they get is handed to them from LionGames
you forget who are the main developers of the game don't you.
Also you're basically saying infuriating the community and making them hate you is the best way to keep people involved. People who just want to play their damn character...
Do you really think people who want to main an unreleased character are going to spend money on a different character, of course not.
The only things recently have been pointless patches and outfits. It's not even as if it fixes gamebreaking bugs or crashes or anything of the sort.
It's complete minimal effort garbage

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Aurith set can be use by all character, all they need to prepare aurith set and wait for Iris released then get the weapon for iris. They have so many thing they can prepare right now. All content they get handed to them from LionGames? isn't JP is the same? but JP is released 2 years. Right now it's more like people being impatience since they already knew all the content! and they want GF to instantly released it, isnt' that is the case? May 31, 2018 Jin Advacement release in KR, and Iris Advancement not goin to release until end of July. It takes 2 months for KR to released Content, it takes us 2 weeks, yes it may not be the content majority like, doesnt mean that content shouldnt be release, just because u don't like it doesnt mean others is not waiting for housing. you give GF 2 years of time same as other server then, when other server also got content from Liongate. Then if GF didnt catch up to where other server is, then you can blame GF for everything then.

You think people that complain about no end game content, once GF released Primal and Iris they will be happy? and they wouldn't complain anymore? no, they will beat that shit in 3-4 weeks and EC all pieces stat, then complain no content, alter of void please. Bcoz they know the future content, so they dont want to be patience they want it as soon as they got their gears. People hating gameforge because they know all the future content, and they can't be patience. not even to wait every 2 weeks to see what content released. And u got KR takes 2 months to another new content, and ppl cant wait for 2 weeks.

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So me having full Aurith C dmg and HP, accessories set and everything I can basically do to prepare for my main and you still have the audacity to say it's me being inpatient and that there's plenty of content.

I would maybe agree with you if the world cup was such a trashy low effort event but dude cmon

Riku · Jun 30th 2018

Quote from Vitae

Quote from Riku

Quote from Vitae

Quote from Riku

Quote from Vitae

So you think it's hard for the publishers...
The people who have ultimate control over how content is distributed. Of course this case is a little special because Liongames has a specific timeline they're keeping to and they also develop the game. But the method of how content is given is seperate to when the content is released, heck if gameforge wanted they could most likely DLC lock characters, as long as Liongames approve.
But seriously dude, read up about gameforge, they have ported many games in the past and killed almost every single one of them. This game will be no exception

Well and you see, check all the update/news date, they been constantly releasing content every 2-3 weeks. Yes some of content might not be what majority people want, but they need to balance between the patch and find the right time to release each patch and how to profit the most. If they released Primal And iris, hardcore gamer still got to end game fast and complain no end game. Then where their profit is? that's why they release maybe the content majority player doesnt want, but there is no other content for them anymore as of now, so if they stay the way they are right now, released new content every two weeks. That means July 4th it will be either Iris, Primal or Both. And they did said it on Twitter please be patience, and it's less than 2 weeks people are saying GF not doin what community want. Isn't it's the people that is being very impatience? if this is KR server, you wouldnt know what u will get in the future patch, will u still be this impatience? KR didnt even get their patch that fast, but ppl expect GF to do it without thinking about their profit, just released all content now and once we done with the end game we will leave. Ur company profit? that is not my concern that for you to figure out urself, we are the community and we are the king. Listen to us that's what majority want. Isn't that's kinda unfair for GF then?

i am not protecting GF or anything, the fact that they still didnt deal with Botter that is something they truly need to work on it. But i really see them constantly release content every 2-3 weeks, just not what majority people want. But some minority is enjoying housing and some are still catching up to the game. (and you have to realized this game released in KR January 18, 2017 and in JP it's April, 2016. JP that is 2 years and KR a year and a half, and it released in NA server Feb 26th, 2018, and you pretty much expect GF to catch up everything in less than 3-4 months. While other server probably make more money and wait longer than us.)

I expect gameforge to catch up?
Well yes considering practically ALL of the content they get is handed to them from LionGames
you forget who are the main developers of the game don't you.
Also you're basically saying infuriating the community and making them hate you is the best way to keep people involved. People who just want to play their damn character...
Do you really think people who want to main an unreleased character are going to spend money on a different character, of course not.
The only things recently have been pointless patches and outfits. It's not even as if it fixes gamebreaking bugs or crashes or anything of the sort.
It's complete minimal effort garbage

Display More
Aurith set can be use by all character, all they need to prepare aurith set and wait for Iris released then get the weapon for iris. They have so many thing they can prepare right now. All content they get handed to them from LionGames? isn't JP is the same? but JP is released 2 years. Right now it's more like people being impatience since they already knew all the content! and they want GF to instantly released it, isnt' that is the case? May 31, 2018 Jin Advacement release in KR, and Iris Advancement not goin to release until end of July. It takes 2 months for KR to released Content, it takes us 2 weeks, yes it may not be the content majority like, doesnt mean that content shouldnt be release, just because u don't like it doesnt mean others is not waiting for housing. you give GF 2 years of time same as other server then, when other server also got content from Liongate. Then if GF didnt catch up to where other server is, then you can blame GF for everything then.

You think people that complain about no end game content, once GF released Primal and Iris they will be happy? and they wouldn't complain anymore? no, they will beat that shit in 3-4 weeks and EC all pieces stat, then complain no content, alter of void please. Bcoz they know the future content, so they dont want to be patience they want it as soon as they got their gears. People hating gameforge because they know all the future content, and they can't be patience. not even to wait every 2 weeks to see what content released. And u got KR takes 2 months to another new content, and ppl cant wait for 2 weeks.

Display More
So me having full Aurith C dmg and HP, accessories set and everything I can basically do to prepare for my main and you still have the audacity to say it's me being inpatient and that there's plenty of content.

I would maybe agree with you if the world cup was such a trashy low effort event but dude cmon

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yes, but are you saying everyone is full aurith C dmg and HP? I worked and have like only couples hrs a day to play, the reason i able to get all HP and Crit dmg gears bcoz i spend SC and sell stuff and able to buy some of the gears. But some F2P players that might not have as much time probably not ready yet either (in fact some players cant even do GC yet or do like 30-40mins GC). That's why i said before, not everybody go in the same pace. I am done and ready for primal all akasha is maxed out. Now i just farm for WUC, EC, and anti destruction for primal weapon when i get it. even with 200 Anti sitting in my bank, i dont even think i am ready yet. That's why i said everyone go different pace, i think GF goin in a okay pace right now. Even P2W ppl dont really wait that long in my opinion, but like i said just because i think it's right pace, for you u think it's slow they need to released stuff quicker.

Yes their event for world cup is trash, that's something i said GF is not the best, still can be better on a lot of the area. But the event bfore for furniture everyone like it, that's not too bad. Then another bad event, GF is shit. and no event also bad. So they are not allow to have No Event, not allow to bad Bad event, only good event is allow. U know how hard is it to satisfied everyone?

Bumluffa · Jun 30th 2018

Quote from Riku

Quote from Vitae

Quote from Riku

Quote from Vitae

Quote from Riku

Well and you see, check all the update/news date, they been constantly releasing content every 2-3 weeks. Yes some of content might not be what majority people want, but they need to balance between the patch and find the right time to release each patch and how to profit the most. If they released Primal And iris, hardcore gamer still got to end game fast and complain no end game. Then where their profit is? that's why they release maybe the content majority player doesnt want, but there is no other content for them anymore as of now, so if they stay the way they are right now, released new content every two weeks. That means July 4th it will be either Iris, Primal or Both. And they did said it on Twitter please be patience, and it's less than 2 weeks people are saying GF not doin what community want. Isn't it's the people that is being very impatience? if this is KR server, you wouldnt know what u will get in the future patch, will u still be this impatience? KR didnt even get their patch that fast, but ppl expect GF to do it without thinking about their profit, just released all content now and once we done with the end game we will leave. Ur company profit? that is not my concern that for you to figure out urself, we are the community and we are the king. Listen to us that's what majority want. Isn't that's kinda unfair for GF then?

i am not protecting GF or anything, the fact that they still didnt deal with Botter that is something they truly need to work on it. But i really see them constantly release content every 2-3 weeks, just not what majority people want. But some minority is enjoying housing and some are still catching up to the game. (and you have to realized this game released in KR January 18, 2017 and in JP it's April, 2016. JP that is 2 years and KR a year and a half, and it released in NA server Feb 26th, 2018, and you pretty much expect GF to catch up everything in less than 3-4 months. While other server probably make more money and wait longer than us.)

I expect gameforge to catch up?
Well yes considering practically ALL of the content they get is handed to them from LionGames
you forget who are the main developers of the game don't you.
Also you're basically saying infuriating the community and making them hate you is the best way to keep people involved. People who just want to play their damn character...
Do you really think people who want to main an unreleased character are going to spend money on a different character, of course not.
The only things recently have been pointless patches and outfits. It's not even as if it fixes gamebreaking bugs or crashes or anything of the sort.
It's complete minimal effort garbage

Display More
Aurith set can be use by all character, all they need to prepare aurith set and wait for Iris released then get the weapon for iris. They have so many thing they can prepare right now. All content they get handed to them from LionGames? isn't JP is the same? but JP is released 2 years. Right now it's more like people being impatience since they already knew all the content! and they want GF to instantly released it, isnt' that is the case? May 31, 2018 Jin Advacement release in KR, and Iris Advancement not goin to release until end of July. It takes 2 months for KR to released Content, it takes us 2 weeks, yes it may not be the content majority like, doesnt mean that content shouldnt be release, just because u don't like it doesnt mean others is not waiting for housing. you give GF 2 years of time same as other server then, when other server also got content from Liongate. Then if GF didnt catch up to where other server is, then you can blame GF for everything then.

You think people that complain about no end game content, once GF released Primal and Iris they will be happy? and they wouldn't complain anymore? no, they will beat that shit in 3-4 weeks and EC all pieces stat, then complain no content, alter of void please. Bcoz they know the future content, so they dont want to be patience they want it as soon as they got their gears. People hating gameforge because they know all the future content, and they can't be patience. not even to wait every 2 weeks to see what content released. And u got KR takes 2 months to another new content, and ppl cant wait for 2 weeks.

Display More
So me having full Aurith C dmg and HP, accessories set and everything I can basically do to prepare for my main and you still have the audacity to say it's me being inpatient and that there's plenty of content.

I would maybe agree with you if the world cup was such a trashy low effort event but dude cmon

Display More
yes, but are you saying everyone is full aurith C dmg and HP? I worked and have like only couples hrs a day to play, the reason i able to get all HP and Crit dmg gears bcoz i spend SC and sell stuff and able to buy some of the gears. But some F2P players that might not have as much time probably not ready yet either (in fact some players cant even do GC yet or do like 30-40mins GC). That's why i said before, not everybody go in the same pace. I am done and ready for primal all akasha is maxed out. Now i just farm for WUC, EC, and anti destruction for primal weapon when i get it. even with 200 Anti sitting in my bank, i dont even think i am ready yet. That's why i said everyone go different pace, i think GF goin in a okay pace right now. Even P2W ppl dont really wait that long in my opinion, but like i said just because i think it's right pace, for you u think it's slow they need to released stuff quicker.

Yes their event for world cup is trash, that's something i said GF is not the best, still can be better on a lot of the area. But the event bfore for furniture everyone like it, that's not too bad. Then another bad event, GF is shit. and no event also bad. So they are not allow to have No Event, not allow to bad Bad event, only good event is allow. U know how hard is it to satisfied everyone?

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Don't bother arguing with these children on here. they are so blinded by their entitlement and hatred for gf that nothing yyou say no matter how much sense it makes won't get through to them

Riku · Jun 30th 2018

Quote from Bumluffa

Quote from Riku

Quote from Vitae

Quote from Riku

Quote from Vitae

I expect gameforge to catch up?
Well yes considering practically ALL of the content they get is handed to them from LionGames
you forget who are the main developers of the game don't you.
Also you're basically saying infuriating the community and making them hate you is the best way to keep people involved. People who just want to play their damn character...
Do you really think people who want to main an unreleased character are going to spend money on a different character, of course not.
The only things recently have been pointless patches and outfits. It's not even as if it fixes gamebreaking bugs or crashes or anything of the sort.
It's complete minimal effort garbage

Display More
Aurith set can be use by all character, all they need to prepare aurith set and wait for Iris released then get the weapon for iris. They have so many thing they can prepare right now. All content they get handed to them from LionGames? isn't JP is the same? but JP is released 2 years. Right now it's more like people being impatience since they already knew all the content! and they want GF to instantly released it, isnt' that is the case? May 31, 2018 Jin Advacement release in KR, and Iris Advancement not goin to release until end of July. It takes 2 months for KR to released Content, it takes us 2 weeks, yes it may not be the content majority like, doesnt mean that content shouldnt be release, just because u don't like it doesnt mean others is not waiting for housing. you give GF 2 years of time same as other server then, when other server also got content from Liongate. Then if GF didnt catch up to where other server is, then you can blame GF for everything then.

You think people that complain about no end game content, once GF released Primal and Iris they will be happy? and they wouldn't complain anymore? no, they will beat that shit in 3-4 weeks and EC all pieces stat, then complain no content, alter of void please. Bcoz they know the future content, so they dont want to be patience they want it as soon as they got their gears. People hating gameforge because they know all the future content, and they can't be patience. not even to wait every 2 weeks to see what content released. And u got KR takes 2 months to another new content, and ppl cant wait for 2 weeks.

Display More
So me having full Aurith C dmg and HP, accessories set and everything I can basically do to prepare for my main and you still have the audacity to say it's me being inpatient and that there's plenty of content.

I would maybe agree with you if the world cup was such a trashy low effort event but dude cmon

Display More
yes, but are you saying everyone is full aurith C dmg and HP? I worked and have like only couples hrs a day to play, the reason i able to get all HP and Crit dmg gears bcoz i spend SC and sell stuff and able to buy some of the gears. But some F2P players that might not have as much time probably not ready yet either (in fact some players cant even do GC yet or do like 30-40mins GC). That's why i said before, not everybody go in the same pace. I am done and ready for primal all akasha is maxed out. Now i just farm for WUC, EC, and anti destruction for primal weapon when i get it. even with 200 Anti sitting in my bank, i dont even think i am ready yet. That's why i said everyone go different pace, i think GF goin in a okay pace right now. Even P2W ppl dont really wait that long in my opinion, but like i said just because i think it's right pace, for you u think it's slow they need to released stuff quicker.

Yes their event for world cup is trash, that's something i said GF is not the best, still can be better on a lot of the area. But the event bfore for furniture everyone like it, that's not too bad. Then another bad event, GF is shit. and no event also bad. So they are not allow to have No Event, not allow to bad Bad event, only good event is allow. U know how hard is it to satisfied everyone?

Display More
Don't bother arguing with these children on here. they are so blinded by their entitlement and hatred for gf that nothing yyou say no matter how much sense it makes won't get through to them

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Well to help people understand that yes GF is not the best, but they are doing what they can probably can be better. But before judging them, try go sign a contract to be a publisher, and then can tell me if they are publisher themselves and have to paid people that work and contract and other expenses, then tell me at that time IF they are still goin to say GF is doing everything wrong. Maybe because i am an account seeing everyone book everyday, their expenses yearly and so on, it's not a small amount of money.

Galpatchie · Jun 30th 2018

I dunno why i even bothered to read whole shenanigan. Nothing new being bought to the topic.

@Moderators PURGE THE HERETICS!

Sabrac · Jun 30th 2018

@Riku.

While i understand what are you trying to say and only GF knows their current situation, i have to disagree, you have stated before that it's necessary to put gambling purchases to earn a profit with their game but thats just a cheap and lazy way to monetize your game when is clear that is not necessarily the case, there are several other companies that develop/publish their games without needing to add such monetization that are clearly made to prey on customers impatient and vulnarability with gambling addctions, they already have other online purchases and if that is not working for them and that they feel force to use this new type of model, perharps they should see the feedback and see why so many members of the comunity had explain over and over their unsatisfaction with their current online shop and if you think is imposible to do a fair and stable way to monetize your customers maybe you should take a look at Digital Extremes and their F2P game Warframe.

You mentioned Blizzard and Square Enix in your previous posts, how do you think they became so big?, They cultivated this trust between their consumers and them and built their game to be polish, when the original final fantasy xiv failed terrible square enix could have easily abandon the project but they assume the responsability and rebuilt the game taking the feedback from their community in mind and now is one of the most popular MMOs out there.

Is sad to see that most of publishers that bring eastern games are like this, so much potential in this game but they lack of vision and let their greed cloud their judgement for a short time profit instead of building and improving their game for the long run.

I can see how this game will end in maintance mode sooner rather than later, just gathering enough revenue to sustain itself and have pretty much a dead player base with just a few whales to sustain them.

Riku · Jun 30th 2018

Quote from Sabrac

@Riku.

While i understand what are you trying to say and only GF knows their current situation, i have to disagree, you have stated before that it's necessary to put gambling purchases to earn a profit with their game but thats just a cheap and lazy way to monetize your game when is clear that is not necessarily the case, there are several other companies that develop/publish their games without needing to add such monetization that are clearly made to prey on customers impatient and vulnarability with gambling addctions, they already have other online purchases and if that is not working for them and that they feel force to use this new type of model, perharps they should see the feedback and see why so many members of the comunity had explain over and over their unsatisfaction with their current online shop and if you think is imposible to do a fair and stable way to monetize your customers maybe you should take a look at Digital Extremes and their F2P game Warframe.

You mentioned Blizzard and Square Enix in your previous posts, how do you think they became so big?, They cultivated this trust between their consumers and them and built their game to be polish, when the original final fantasy xiv failed terrible square enix could have easily abandon the project but they assume the responsability and rebuilt the game taking the feedback from their community in mind and now is one of the most popular MMOs out there.

Is sad to see that most of publishers that bring eastern games are like this, so much potential in this game but they lack of vision and let their greed cloud their judgement for a short time profit instead of building and improving their game for the long run.

I can see how this game will end in maintance mode sooner rather than later, just gathering enough revenue to sustain itself and have pretty much a dead player base with just a few whales to sustain them.

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You do also realized that those game you mentioned also has game in Console platform that makes money right? so is square enix also have product sell in console. So where is gameforge getting their money? And this RNG boxes also in other server as well, and it's not like GF is forcing u to buy it? people that willing to gamble can gamble, and if u want outfit u can buy it from those players. And it's expensive because first DZ is worthless cost by Botter not by RNG box. U think those company u many their asset, capital, and equity is the same amount as Gameforge?

http://www.hd.square-enix.com/eng/pdf/ar_2016en.pdf

http://www.files.services/file…428164100_63579193_en.pdf

one is Square enix 2016 annual report and another one is Digital Extremes financial report. And both company is Public company whereas Gameforge is private company. In a year Digital extremes has $75 Milions of profit and Square enix has 176Millions Profit in 2016 (so you are telling me that Gameforge make anywhere close to where those company make? Millions?If they did, they probably went public already.) And look at their equity and so on. Tell me you are telling me that those company is not big? and u try to compare it to gameforge a private company? probably not even big enough to be able to go public at all. And we don't even have to talk about Investor that invest into those public company. U can look through the Financial statement yourself.

and if you compare KR to Gameforge? it's also completely different balls game,

http://investors.lionsgate.com…ts/2017-annual-report.pdf

This is lionsgate annual report, that's why korean has a better event and so on, since liongate is huge. But gameforge is just a publisher and you expect a publisher to become a developer. If they are big enough to do whatever they want, they wouldnt be publisher, they will become developer themselves.A publisher is trying to make money in the same time try their best to meet their community needs, but they cant just meet community needs without thinking about their survival and people they have to pay and contract that they are bind to.

"Overall, it is much easier to invest in a publicly traded firm than a privately-held company. Public companies, especially larger ones, can easily be bought and sold on the stock market and, therefore, have superior liquidity and a quote market value. Conversely, it can be years before a private firm can again be sold and prices must be negotiated between the seller and buyer."

And Gameforge = Privately-held company, all other company you mentioned = Publicly traded firm.

And you mentioned why other company cares about community?

Investing in a public company may seem far superior to investing in a private one, but there are a handful of benefits to not being public. A major criticism of many public firms is that they are overly focused on quarterly results and meeting Wall Street analysts' short-term expectations. This can cause them to miss out on long-term value-creating opportunities, such as investing in a product that may take years to develop, hurting profits in the near term.

If they screw up, their investor will leave and cost them most lost and so on. Therefore, why those company u mentioned care so much about community. Not saying gameforge doesnt, just that they are limited by a lot other thing compare to publicly traded company.

SaiNSuki · Jun 30th 2018

Quote from Riku

Quote from Sabrac

@Riku.

While i understand what are you trying to say and only GF knows their current situation, i have to disagree, you have stated before that it's necessary to put gambling purchases to earn a profit with their game but thats just a cheap and lazy way to monetize your game when is clear that is not necessarily the case, there are several other companies that develop/publish their games without needing to add such monetization that are clearly made to prey on customers impatient and vulnarability with gambling addctions, they already have other online purchases and if that is not working for them and that they feel force to use this new type of model, perharps they should see the feedback and see why so many members of the comunity had explain over and over their unsatisfaction with their current online shop and if you think is imposible to do a fair and stable way to monetize your customers maybe you should take a look at Digital Extremes and their F2P game Warframe.

You mentioned Blizzard and Square Enix in your previous posts, how do you think they became so big?, They cultivated this trust between their consumers and them and built their game to be polish, when the original final fantasy xiv failed terrible square enix could have easily abandon the project but they assume the responsability and rebuilt the game taking the feedback from their community in mind and now is one of the most popular MMOs out there.

Is sad to see that most of publishers that bring eastern games are like this, so much potential in this game but they lack of vision and let their greed cloud their judgement for a short time profit instead of building and improving their game for the long run.

I can see how this game will end in maintance mode sooner rather than later, just gathering enough revenue to sustain itself and have pretty much a dead player base with just a few whales to sustain them.

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You do also realized that those game you mentioned also has game in Console platform that makes money right? so is square enix also have product sell in console. So where is gameforge getting their money? And this RNG boxes also in other server as well, and it's not like GF is forcing u to buy it? people that willing to gamble can gamble, and if u want outfit u can buy it from those players. And it's expensive because first DZ is worthless cost by Botter not by RNG box. U think those company u many their asset, capital, and equity is the same amount as Gameforge?

http://www.hd.square-enix.com/eng/pdf/ar_2016en.pdf

http://www.files.services/file…428164100_63579193_en.pdf

one is Square enix 2016 annual report and another one is Digital Extremes financial report. And both company is Public company whereas Gameforge is private company. In a year Digital extremes has $75k of profit and Square enix has 176k Profit in 2016. And look at their equity and so on. Tell me you are telling me that those company is not big? and u try to compare it to gameforge a private company? probably not even big enough to be able to go public at all. And we don't even have to talk about Investor that invest into those public company. U can look through the Financial statement yourself.

and if you compare KR to Gameforge? it's also completely different balls game,

http://investors.lionsgate.com…ts/2017-annual-report.pdf

This is lionsgate annual report, that's why korean has a better event and so on, since liongate is huge. But gameforge is just a publisher and you expect a publisher to become a developer. If they are big enough to do whatever they want, they wouldnt be publisher, they will become developer themselves.A publisher is trying to make money in the same time try their best to meet their community needs, but they cant just meet community needs without thinking about their survival and people they have to pay and contract that they are bind to.

"Overall, it is much easier to invest in a publicly traded firm than a privately-held company. Public companies, especially larger ones, can easily be bought and sold on the stock market and, therefore, have superior liquidity and a quote market value. Conversely, it can be years before a private firm can again be sold and prices must be negotiated between the seller and buyer."

And Gameforge = Privately-held company, all other company you mentioned = Publicly traded firm.

Display More

Uh, you know KR is Liongames and not Lionsgate right?

Sabrac · Jun 30th 2018

Quote from Riku

Quote from Sabrac

@Riku.

While i understand what are you trying to say and only GF knows their current situation, i have to disagree, you have stated before that it's necessary to put gambling purchases to earn a profit with their game but thats just a cheap and lazy way to monetize your game when is clear that is not necessarily the case, there are several other companies that develop/publish their games without needing to add such monetization that are clearly made to prey on customers impatient and vulnarability with gambling addctions, they already have other online purchases and if that is not working for them and that they feel force to use this new type of model, perharps they should see the feedback and see why so many members of the comunity had explain over and over their unsatisfaction with their current online shop and if you think is imposible to do a fair and stable way to monetize your customers maybe you should take a look at Digital Extremes and their F2P game Warframe.

You mentioned Blizzard and Square Enix in your previous posts, how do you think they became so big?, They cultivated this trust between their consumers and them and built their game to be polish, when the original final fantasy xiv failed terrible square enix could have easily abandon the project but they assume the responsability and rebuilt the game taking the feedback from their community in mind and now is one of the most popular MMOs out there.

Is sad to see that most of publishers that bring eastern games are like this, so much potential in this game but they lack of vision and let their greed cloud their judgement for a short time profit instead of building and improving their game for the long run.

I can see how this game will end in maintance mode sooner rather than later, just gathering enough revenue to sustain itself and have pretty much a dead player base with just a few whales to sustain them.

Display More
You do also realized that those game you mentioned also has game in Console platform that makes money right? so is square enix also have product sell in console. So where is gameforge getting their money? And this RNG boxes also in other server as well, and it's not like GF is forcing u to buy it? people that willing to gamble can gamble, and if u want outfit u can buy it from those players. And it's expensive because first DZ is worthless cost by Botter not by RNG box. U think those company u many their asset, capital, and equity is the same amount as Gameforge?

http://www.hd.square-enix.com/eng/pdf/ar_2016en.pdf

http://www.files.services/file…428164100_63579193_en.pdf

one is Square enix 2016 annual report and another one is Digital Extremes financial report. And both company is Public company whereas Gameforge is private company. In a year Digital extremes has $75 Milions of profit and Square enix has 176Millions Profit in 2016 (so you are telling me that Gameforge make anywhere close to where those company make? Millions?If they did, they probably went public already.) And look at their equity and so on. Tell me you are telling me that those company is not big? and u try to compare it to gameforge a private company? probably not even big enough to be able to go public at all. And we don't even have to talk about Investor that invest into those public company. U can look through the Financial statement yourself.

and if you compare KR to Gameforge? it's also completely different balls game,

http://investors.lionsgate.com…ts/2017-annual-report.pdf

This is lionsgate annual report, that's why korean has a better event and so on, since liongate is huge. But gameforge is just a publisher and you expect a publisher to become a developer. If they are big enough to do whatever they want, they wouldnt be publisher, they will become developer themselves.A publisher is trying to make money in the same time try their best to meet their community needs, but they cant just meet community needs without thinking about their survival and people they have to pay and contract that they are bind to.

"Overall, it is much easier to invest in a publicly traded firm than a privately-held company. Public companies, especially larger ones, can easily be bought and sold on the stock market and, therefore, have superior liquidity and a quote market value. Conversely, it can be years before a private firm can again be sold and prices must be negotiated between the seller and buyer."

And Gameforge = Privately-held company, all other company you mentioned = Publicly traded firm.

And you mentioned why other company cares about community?

Investing in a public company may seem far superior to investing in a private one, but there are a handful of benefits to not being public. A major criticism of many public firms is that they are overly focused on quarterly results and meeting Wall Street analysts' short-term expectations. This can cause them to miss out on long-term value-creating opportunities, such as investing in a product that may take years to develop, hurting profits in the near term.

If they screw up, their investor will leave and cost them most lost and so on. Therefore, why those company u mentioned care so much about community. Not saying gameforge doesnt, just that they are limited by a lot other thing compare to publicly traded company.

Display More

You completely missed my point, of course Digital Extremes, Blizzard, Square Enix are big companies right now and have a large amount of revenue, what i said was that they were not the titans that they are today, they started small and humble with little resources and your way of thinking sounds like what a corporate excutive would say "You don't have to enter a casino and gamble all your money is all optional", everything is optional, playing this game is optional, trying to justify your unethical stradegies to exploit your consumers is just plain manipulate and disgusting by using that line of defense just proves how much you care for yourself as a consumer.

Blizzard is guilty in this way of thinking too and when they might have found a balance between selling those lootboxes and keep upgrading their games but even then i won't support that way of thinking even if most of their community have agreed to have them in order to obtain more free content.

Warframe launch was received as a mediocre game at best and bad game at worst, yet the developers persisted and continue to improve and grow their game into becoming one of Steam top 10 most played games and has stayed there for a long time.

I know is not an apples to apples comparison and that GF doesn't develop the game however they do have control over the cash shop and can decide what and how much to sell their products to their consumers.

At the end of the day every company needs to make a profit thats their purpose after all, what i've tried to say in my previous post was that they don't need to neglect their own costumers in order to earn a profit and keep their buisness afloat they can obatain the right balance if they put enough effort into it.

Rin · Jun 30th 2018

Quote from Sabrac

@Riku.

While i understand what are you trying to say and only GF knows their current situation, i have to disagree, you have stated before that it's necessary to put gambling purchases to earn a profit with their game but thats just a cheap and lazy way to monetize your game when is clear that is not necessarily the case, there are several other companies that develop/publish their games without needing to add such monetization that are clearly made to prey on customers impatient and vulnarability with gambling addctions, they already have other online purchases and if that is not working for them and that they feel force to use this new type of model, perharps they should see the feedback and see why so many members of the comunity had explain over and over their unsatisfaction with their current online shop and if you think is imposible to do a fair and stable way to monetize your customers maybe you should take a look at Digital Extremes and their F2P game Warframe.

You mentioned Blizzard and Square Enix in your previous posts, how do you think they became so big?, They cultivated this trust between their consumers and them and built their game to be polish, when the original final fantasy xiv failed terrible square enix could have easily abandon the project but they assume the responsability and rebuilt the game taking the feedback from their community in mind and now is one of the most popular MMOs out there.

Is sad to see that most of publishers that bring eastern games are like this, so much potential in this game but they lack of vision and let their greed cloud their judgement for a short time profit instead of building and improving their game for the long run.

I can see how this game will end in maintance mode sooner rather than later, just gathering enough revenue to sustain itself and have pretty much a dead player base with just a few whales to sustain them.

Display More

Let us the evaluate the factors of such a contention.

North American players prefer high optical quality games. Failed.

North American players prefer mainstream games. Failed.

North American players prefer varied gameplay. Failed.

The first premise attracts a large playerbase.

The second premise also does the same.

Korean Grinder dungeon MMOs are the farthest thing from varied gameplay.

Social co-op games with large population base translates to high variability / distinct gameplay with every single iteration of a round, instance, or match.

Shooter games will always intrinsically be more appealing to a larger audience than one with more barriers to gameplay .

MMOs have keyboards. MMOs require graphic cards.

Consoles are standardized. Controls are simpler.

MMOS require internet connection and decent computer.

MMOS require knowledge to play efficiently and effectively, shooters not as much - more hands-on.

Furthermore, games for which the publisher are the also the developers themselves have more flexibility in terms of how they plan their content releases, how they can integrate feedback from the community (no time zone lag/communication problems, expedient fixes), and various other perks that a sole publisher does not get to have depending on the terms of the game license.

The first name you taken had a first move advantage, and the second already has a pre-established franchise, they are also both developers of their own content, for which GF has absolutely no control over.

A niche anime game. ✓

Many implemented RNG systems by the devs; starting from upgrading all the way to akashi cards. ✓

Segregated group content (levels). ✓

Progression gear system dependent on periodic updates. ✓

The first factor means you need to cover overhead costs quickly, as the playerbase function of all MMO is and will always be going to zero for when the rate of content churn is faster than the rate of content production, and when the main game premise revolves around progression.

The second factor already presupposes the supposition of monetization solely by RNG means, above all else. Even if the cosmetics were cheap, how many people are going to pay up monthly for new costumes - and how many are going to remain in a game where you must grind 40 - 80/hrs a week. Not many will stay just to play costume simulator, there are many other games on the marketplace that can do that for you at a cheaper price point. Is it easier to convince 10 people to pay $10,000 or 10,000 people to pay $10? Personally, it's easier to fool 10 people especially if the propensity to spend is high because they make $200k-$10M/year.

The red curve shows the left-skew distribution of a cumulative probability function for the chance of spending as a function of spending. As spending increases, the number of players that can afford to do so decreases drastically. Technically the red curve should be shifted to the left a little bit. Essentially, the red curve is telling you that by setting a price point for a fixed price of anything, you are losing out on the revenue gained from the potential players that are able to gamble 30 cents to a dollar per box. If you set wings = $1,000, maybe 10 people on the server will buy it, but you will lose out greatly.

The yellow curve starting @ origin point 1 delineates the percentage of playerbase that would spend as a function of increased spending, it drops slower at the beginning because many players will value things more when things are cheaper, and quickly drops off quickly when the unitary cost point of things exceeds their threshold of valuation.

The blue function is the total quantity of money spent.

The green curve multiplies revenue (blue) with yellow curve (players total) that spend. As you can see, at high margins, revenue is maximized no matter the scenario.

Segregated gating as game design is horrific, as it dissuades new players from playing with older players and causes a cascade of solo experiences later on as one progresses through the pyramid structure of leveling. Lv1-3, Lv4-5, Level6-8 and so on dungeons, even worse so with it not being omni-channel omni-server based queuing.

Players who play solo will quickly quit; SW is not a campaign game, and it was never designed to be one.

A progression gear system like SW requires repetitive grinding, with almost zero variational elements. Mobs spawn at same time, bosses do the same mechanics; the chaining of mechanics is extremely simplistic. The dungeons are not randomly generated. You do not get to switch strategies or do anything relatively different whatsoever. Once you get your gear, that's it. A game without high capital funds to start off to create a massive content wall with dedicated playerbase or first's mover advantage into a MMORPG space will never have a sustained ecosystem of players to recirculate throughout all the content levels, and all the dungeons, raids, etc; even more so for niche games which do not appeal to western gamers.

Just look at anime games, visual novels or anything of that sort and compare it to the relative popularity of 'big' games and big AAA titles. GF are not the devs. They cannot do anything. They cannot make the content. They can request changes and nerf or boost rates, but making everything obsolete faster just means a faster decay rate of the playerbase.

It is true that in terms of the communal functions that GF does, it is incredibly mediocre relative to all other publishers out there; whether it be streaming content, having tiered spender events or whatever.

None of the arguments of those points are cogent enough to apply to SW's circumstances. JP and KR were dead before, and KR only got a population boost after the fem- drama with closers, thus the devs dedicated more proportionate resources to enticing the new and rejuvanated playerbase. All MMOs follow the same waning trend, if they are not well-pollished with abundant content to start off with, along with a slew of excess activities to keep people entertained. This is why you see the consolidation of big titles to big publishers because they have the resources available to sustain large playerbases, with ticket systems, etc and much better attractive price points for all items. KR probably has 5x the active playerbase than here. KR and JP also have work environments that are not conductive to heavy grinding where people don't just up and go like in NA at their jobs, and where many other games are competing for their attention and mobile games too, so obviously the EXP rates/other things must be easier to obtain.

The reality is as such is, because of the circumstances that make it so.

I still do not see many low levels purchasing outfits, and I still do not see many low levels making it past Candus city. And of those people in Ruin Fortress, I do not see them grinding long and hard after they get their vicarious set. Out of the 18-25 demographic, do you think they are endowed with millions of dollars or high-paying deluxe consultant/engineer/tech jobs or embroiled in a slew of student loans/parent money/part-time jobs? I am pretty sure that getting $10 from 5,000 players per month is not enough to pay 15 people and a game license per year, even at EU's (median) minimum wage (of such countries that participate in such social policies).

Even if you gave them instant plus 8 gear and good line stat rolls, what are these people going to do all day. The proportion of people who play Socialworker or Houseworker or Pvpworker is extremely small because it is not gratifying to do so for most people and enjoyable. MOBA games, shooters and the like are an entirely different category altogether.

Money does not fly from thin air into publisher's hands. And publishers do not suddenly become developers overnight. I don't like GF as much as anyone does but when you set yourself up to high expectations with zero costs limitations, that is nothing more than a fairy pipe dream, and when you understand that the game design and content available is already 'wall' blocked to the casual audience which is most people, and not attuned enough for the 40/80hr week crowd who finishes everything in 3 weeks, then there is nothing else to argue except a declining playerbase irrespective of GF's decisions. Every Korean Anime MMO follows the same path with small publishers or no-name publishers.

A declining playerbase means either the server is shut down once spending is stopped, or the churning of costumes/spending events/things are increased to compensate for the shortfall. That is reality. If you don't like it, then you don't have to spend on the game on day 1, and you don't have to support the publisher. It is your free choice to 'dodge' shady/irreputable publishers who mismanage their games' rates/monetization schemes, and it is also a consequence as to why there's no new 'next' fix MMOS in the market with people unwilling to spend, while mobile games become a lucrative means to end and the rest few a domineering market of few large game studios.

You voted to not spend. You opted to quit when there's no new content. You demand content to be localized and released all in 40 days with double money back guarantees. You had your fair share of F2P crowding through MMO after MMO to find that 'special' one.

The result? You get what you pay for. Low-quality money grab publishers that cater to anything but 'the next fix' crowd, with the same quest systems, the exact same content grinding, etc. Innovation only comes if theres resources and capital to invest in. That is fact, nothing will change, and all will be status quo.

Also RNG boxes do exist in some games of the first dev company, and the second company only off-branched to MMOs after having initial successes from a niche audience; both are subs. SW is not a sub-game and will never be. If it was, all of us would of quitted and that $20/month would not pay for the servers or staffs' salaries. If it was higher, no one would spend.

MMOs are capital-intensive, and offer shit returns when you try something new and fail.

Copy everyone else, expect the same results. Profits, then shut down. The cycle of consumer and producer dynamics won't change unless the players (marketplace) decides to change their wallet voting power.

Also the IQ distribution of individuals combined with the personality dimensions of the male 18-25 demographics guarantees that this cash cow of RNG works forever.

Inability to defer gratification + Gambler's Fallacy susceptibility + Oversensitized dopamine system to rewards; skewed risk-reward ratio profiling + Disposable income = Free money

Smartphone games, browser games, MMO games, card games. Medium changes, playerbase doesn't. Unethical? Maybe, but no one puts a gun to your head to swipe. Sucks? Definitely, so are you going to spend more on housing and costumes to make up for the shortfall in the other F2P who won't spend? Or what other ways would you propose to spend money on SW? I don't see any other avenues, a necessary evil as it is.

Riku · Jun 30th 2018

Quote from SaiNSuki

Quote from Riku

Quote from Sabrac

@Riku.

While i understand what are you trying to say and only GF knows their current situation, i have to disagree, you have stated before that it's necessary to put gambling purchases to earn a profit with their game but thats just a cheap and lazy way to monetize your game when is clear that is not necessarily the case, there are several other companies that develop/publish their games without needing to add such monetization that are clearly made to prey on customers impatient and vulnarability with gambling addctions, they already have other online purchases and if that is not working for them and that they feel force to use this new type of model, perharps they should see the feedback and see why so many members of the comunity had explain over and over their unsatisfaction with their current online shop and if you think is imposible to do a fair and stable way to monetize your customers maybe you should take a look at Digital Extremes and their F2P game Warframe.

You mentioned Blizzard and Square Enix in your previous posts, how do you think they became so big?, They cultivated this trust between their consumers and them and built their game to be polish, when the original final fantasy xiv failed terrible square enix could have easily abandon the project but they assume the responsability and rebuilt the game taking the feedback from their community in mind and now is one of the most popular MMOs out there.

Is sad to see that most of publishers that bring eastern games are like this, so much potential in this game but they lack of vision and let their greed cloud their judgement for a short time profit instead of building and improving their game for the long run.

I can see how this game will end in maintance mode sooner rather than later, just gathering enough revenue to sustain itself and have pretty much a dead player base with just a few whales to sustain them.

Display More
You do also realized that those game you mentioned also has game in Console platform that makes money right? so is square enix also have product sell in console. So where is gameforge getting their money? And this RNG boxes also in other server as well, and it's not like GF is forcing u to buy it? people that willing to gamble can gamble, and if u want outfit u can buy it from those players. And it's expensive because first DZ is worthless cost by Botter not by RNG box. U think those company u many their asset, capital, and equity is the same amount as Gameforge?

http://www.hd.square-enix.com/eng/pdf/ar_2016en.pdf

http://www.files.services/file…428164100_63579193_en.pdf

one is Square enix 2016 annual report and another one is Digital Extremes financial report. And both company is Public company whereas Gameforge is private company. In a year Digital extremes has $75k of profit and Square enix has 176k Profit in 2016. And look at their equity and so on. Tell me you are telling me that those company is not big? and u try to compare it to gameforge a private company? probably not even big enough to be able to go public at all. And we don't even have to talk about Investor that invest into those public company. U can look through the Financial statement yourself.

and if you compare KR to Gameforge? it's also completely different balls game,

http://investors.lionsgate.com…ts/2017-annual-report.pdf

This is lionsgate annual report, that's why korean has a better event and so on, since liongate is huge. But gameforge is just a publisher and you expect a publisher to become a developer. If they are big enough to do whatever they want, they wouldnt be publisher, they will become developer themselves.A publisher is trying to make money in the same time try their best to meet their community needs, but they cant just meet community needs without thinking about their survival and people they have to pay and contract that they are bind to.

"Overall, it is much easier to invest in a publicly traded firm than a privately-held company. Public companies, especially larger ones, can easily be bought and sold on the stock market and, therefore, have superior liquidity and a quote market value. Conversely, it can be years before a private firm can again be sold and prices must be negotiated between the seller and buyer."

And Gameforge = Privately-held company, all other company you mentioned = Publicly traded firm.

Display More
Uh, you know KR is Liongames and not Lionsgate right?

Display More

Oops. wrong company. and Yea Liongames is a privately held company as well.

Riku · Jun 30th 2018

Quote from Rin

Quote from Sabrac

@Riku.

While i understand what are you trying to say and only GF knows their current situation, i have to disagree, you have stated before that it's necessary to put gambling purchases to earn a profit with their game but thats just a cheap and lazy way to monetize your game when is clear that is not necessarily the case, there are several other companies that develop/publish their games without needing to add such monetization that are clearly made to prey on customers impatient and vulnarability with gambling addctions, they already have other online purchases and if that is not working for them and that they feel force to use this new type of model, perharps they should see the feedback and see why so many members of the comunity had explain over and over their unsatisfaction with their current online shop and if you think is imposible to do a fair and stable way to monetize your customers maybe you should take a look at Digital Extremes and their F2P game Warframe.

You mentioned Blizzard and Square Enix in your previous posts, how do you think they became so big?, They cultivated this trust between their consumers and them and built their game to be polish, when the original final fantasy xiv failed terrible square enix could have easily abandon the project but they assume the responsability and rebuilt the game taking the feedback from their community in mind and now is one of the most popular MMOs out there.

Is sad to see that most of publishers that bring eastern games are like this, so much potential in this game but they lack of vision and let their greed cloud their judgement for a short time profit instead of building and improving their game for the long run.

I can see how this game will end in maintance mode sooner rather than later, just gathering enough revenue to sustain itself and have pretty much a dead player base with just a few whales to sustain them.

Display More

Let us the evaluate the factors of such a contention.

North American players prefer high optical quality games. Failed.

North American players prefer mainstream games. Failed.

North American players prefer varied gameplay. Failed.

The first premise attracts a large playerbase.

The second premise also does the same.

Korean Grinder dungeon MMOs are the farthest thing from varied gameplay.

Social co-op games with large population base translates to high variability / distinct gameplay with every single iteration of a round, instance, or match.

Shooter games will always intrinsically be more appealing to a larger audience than one with more barriers to gameplay .

MMOs have keyboards. MMOs require graphic cards.

Consoles are standardized. Controls are simpler.

MMOS require internet connection and decent computer.

MMOS require knowledge to play efficiently and effectively, shooters not as much - more hands-on.

Furthermore, games for which the publisher are the also the developers themselves have more flexibility in terms of how they plan their content releases, how they can integrate feedback from the community (no time zone lag/communication problems, expedient fixes), and various other perks that a sole publisher does not get to have depending on the terms of the game license.

The first name you taken had a first move advantage, and the second already has a pre-established franchise, they are also both developers of their own content, for which GF has absolutely no control over.

A niche anime game. ✓

Many implemented RNG systems by the devs; starting from upgrading all the way to akashi cards. ✓

Segregated group content (levels). ✓

Progression gear system dependent on periodic updates. ✓

The first factor means you need to cover overhead costs quickly, as the playerbase function of all MMO is and will always be going to zero for when the rate of content churn is faster than the rate of content production, and when the main game premise revolves around progression.

The second factor already presupposes the supposition of monetization solely by RNG means, above all else. Even if the cosmetics were cheap, how many people are going to pay up monthly for new costumes - and how many are going to remain in a game where you must grind 40 - 80/hrs a week. Not many will stay just to play costume simulator, there are many other games on the marketplace that can do that for you at a cheaper price point. Is it easier to convince 10 people to pay $10,000 or 10,000 people to pay $10? Personally, it's easier to fool 10 people especially if the propensity to spend is high because they make $200k-$10M/year.

The red curve shows the left-skew distribution of a cumulative probability function for the chance of spending as a function of spending. As spending increases, the number of players that can afford to do so decreases drastically. Technically the red curve should be shifted to the left a little bit. Essentially, the red curve is telling you that by setting a price point for a fixed price of anything, you are losing out on the revenue gained from the potential players that are able to gamble 30 cents to a dollar per box. If you set wings = $1,000, maybe 10 people on the server will buy it, but you will lose out greatly.

The yellow curve starting @ origin point 1 delineates the percentage of playerbase that would spend as a function of increased spending, it drops slower at the beginning because many players will value things more when things are cheaper, and quickly drops off quickly when the unitary cost point of things exceeds their threshold of valuation.

The blue function is the total quantity of money spent.

The green curve multiplies revenue (blue) with yellow curve (players total) that spend. As you can see, at high margins, revenue is maximized no matter the scenario.

Segregated gating as game design is horrific, as it dissuades new players from playing with older players and causes a cascade of solo experiences later on as one progresses through the pyramid structure of leveling. Lv1-3, Lv4-5, Level6-8 and so on dungeons, even worse so with it not being omni-channel omni-server based queuing.

Players who play solo will quickly quit; SW is not a campaign game, and it was never designed to be one.

A progression gear system like SW requires repetitive grinding, with almost zero variational elements. Mobs spawn at same time, bosses do the same mechanics; the chaining of mechanics is extremely simplistic. The dungeons are not randomly generated. You do not get to switch strategies or do anything relatively different whatsoever. Once you get your gear, that's it. A game without high capital funds to start off to create a massive content wall with dedicated playerbase or first's mover advantage into a MMORPG space will never have a sustained ecosystem of players to recirculate throughout all the content levels, and all the dungeons, raids, etc; even more so for niche games which do not appeal to western gamers.

Just look at anime games, visual novels or anything of that sort and compare it to the relative popularity of 'big' games and big AAA titles. GF are not the devs. They cannot do anything. They cannot make the content. They can request changes and nerf or boost rates, but making everything obsolete faster just means a faster decay rate of the playerbase.

It is true that in terms of the communal functions that GF does, it is incredibly mediocre relative to all other publishers out there; whether it be streaming content, having tiered spender events or whatever.

None of the arguments of those points are cogent enough to apply to SW's circumstances. JP and KR were dead before, and KR only got a population boost after the fem- drama with closers, thus the devs dedicated more proportionate resources to enticing the new and rejuvanated playerbase. All MMOs follow the same waning trend, if they are not well-pollished with abundant content to start off with, along with a slew of excess activities to keep people entertained. This is why you see the consolidation of big titles to big publishers because they have the resources available to sustain large playerbases, with ticket systems, etc and much better attractive price points for all items. KR probably has 5x the active playerbase than here. KR and JP also have work environments that are not conductive to heavy grinding where people don't just up and go like in NA at their jobs, and where many other games are competing for their attention and mobile games too, so obviously the EXP rates/other things must be easier to obtain.

The reality is as such is, because of the circumstances that make it so.

I still do not see many low levels purchasing outfits, and I still do not see many low levels making it past Candus city. And of those people in Ruin Fortress, I do not see them grinding long and hard after they get their vicarious set. Out of the 18-25 demographic, do you think they are endowed with millions of dollars or high-paying deluxe consultant/engineer/tech jobs or embroiled in a slew of student loans/parent money/part-time jobs? I am pretty sure that getting $10 from 5,000 players per month is not enough to pay 15 people and a game license per year, even at EU's (median) minimum wage (of such countries that participate in such social policies).

Even if you gave them instant plus 8 gear and good line stat rolls, what are these people going to do all day. The proportion of people who play Socialworker or Houseworker or Pvpworker is extremely small because it is not gratifying to do so for most people and enjoyable. MOBA games, shooters and the like are an entirely different category altogether.

Money does not fly from thin air into publisher's hands. And publishers do not suddenly become developers overnight. I don't like GF as much as anyone does but when you set yourself up to high expectations with zero costs limitations, that is nothing more than a fairy pipe dream, and when you understand that the game design and content available is already 'wall' blocked to the casual audience which is most people, and not attuned enough for the 40/80hr week crowd who finishes everything in 3 weeks, then there is nothing else to argue except a declining playerbase irrespective of GF's decisions. Every Korean Anime MMO follows the same path with small publishers or no-name publishers.

A declining playerbase means either the server is shut down once spending is stopped, or the churning of costumes/spending events/things are increased to compensate for the shortfall. That is reality. If you don't like it, then you don't have to spend on the game on day 1, and you don't have to support the publisher. It is your free choice to 'dodge' shady/irreputable publishers who mismanage their games' rates/monetization schemes, and it is also a consequence as to why there's no new 'next' fix MMOS in the market with people unwilling to spend, while mobile games become a lucrative means to end and the rest few a domineering market of few large game studios.

You voted to not spend. You opted to quit when there's no new content. You demand content to be localized and released all in 40 days with double money back guarantees. You had your fair share of F2P crowding through MMO after MMO to find that 'special' one.

The result? You get what you pay for. Low-quality money grab publishers that cater to anything but 'the next fix' crowd, with the same quest systems, the exact same content grinding, etc. Innovation only comes if theres resources and capital to invest in. That is fact, nothing will change, and all will be status quo.

Also RNG boxes do exist in some games of the first dev company, and the second company only off-branched to MMOs after having initial successes from a niche audience; both are subs. SW is not a sub-game and will never be. If it was, all of us would of quitted and that $20/month would not pay for the servers or staffs' salaries. If it was higher, no one would spend.

MMOs are capital-intensive, and offer shit returns when you try something new and fail.

Copy everyone else, expect the same results. Profits, then shut down. The cycle of consumer and producer dynamics won't change unless the players (marketplace) decides to change their wallet voting power.

Also the IQ distribution of individuals combined with the personality dimensions of the male 18-25 demographics guarantees that this cash cow of RNG works forever.

Inability to defer gratification + Gambler's Fallacy susceptibility + Oversensitized dopamine system to rewards; skewed risk-reward ratio profiling + Disposable income = Free money

Smartphone games, browser games, MMO games, card games. Medium changes, playerbase doesn't. Unethical? Maybe, but no one puts a gun to your head to swipe. Sucks? Definitely, so are you going to spend more on housing and costumes to make up for the shortfall in the other F2P who won't spend? Or what other ways would you propose to spend money on SW? I don't see any other avenues, a necessary evil as it is.

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Thank you for writing all those, you went through in a lot more detail and better wording than me. Appreciate your effort and the time you put in to write it out. And i agreed so all the point you stated, it's just sad that seeing people are blaming on publisher, if they do not like it, they are more than happy to move along and find other publisher they think it's better than. That's just my opinion, like u said no one point a gun to your head to play or to swipe or to get the wings whatsoever. But at the end, everyone have the freedom of speech to blame or say stuff that is suited them or make themselves feel better. At the end of the day, once player got tired of the game they will move on and go to other game.

Iris Yuma · Jun 30th 2018

Quote from Sabrac

Quote from Riku

Quote from Sabrac

@Riku.

While i understand what are you trying to say and only GF knows their current situation, i have to disagree, you have stated before that it's necessary to put gambling purchases to earn a profit with their game but thats just a cheap and lazy way to monetize your game when is clear that is not necessarily the case, there are several other companies that develop/publish their games without needing to add such monetization that are clearly made to prey on customers impatient and vulnarability with gambling addctions, they already have other online purchases and if that is not working for them and that they feel force to use this new type of model, perharps they should see the feedback and see why so many members of the comunity had explain over and over their unsatisfaction with their current online shop and if you think is imposible to do a fair and stable way to monetize your customers maybe you should take a look at Digital Extremes and their F2P game Warframe.

You mentioned Blizzard and Square Enix in your previous posts, how do you think they became so big?, They cultivated this trust between their consumers and them and built their game to be polish, when the original final fantasy xiv failed terrible square enix could have easily abandon the project but they assume the responsability and rebuilt the game taking the feedback from their community in mind and now is one of the most popular MMOs out there.

Is sad to see that most of publishers that bring eastern games are like this, so much potential in this game but they lack of vision and let their greed cloud their judgement for a short time profit instead of building and improving their game for the long run.

I can see how this game will end in maintance mode sooner rather than later, just gathering enough revenue to sustain itself and have pretty much a dead player base with just a few whales to sustain them.

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You do also realized that those game you mentioned also has game in Console platform that makes money right? so is square enix also have product sell in console. So where is gameforge getting their money? And this RNG boxes also in other server as well, and it's not like GF is forcing u to buy it? people that willing to gamble can gamble, and if u want outfit u can buy it from those players. And it's expensive because first DZ is worthless cost by Botter not by RNG box. U think those company u many their asset, capital, and equity is the same amount as Gameforge?

http://www.hd.square-enix.com/eng/pdf/ar_2016en.pdf

http://www.files.services/file…428164100_63579193_en.pdf

one is Square enix 2016 annual report and another one is Digital Extremes financial report. And both company is Public company whereas Gameforge is private company. In a year Digital extremes has $75 Milions of profit and Square enix has 176Millions Profit in 2016 (so you are telling me that Gameforge make anywhere close to where those company make? Millions?If they did, they probably went public already.) And look at their equity and so on. Tell me you are telling me that those company is not big? and u try to compare it to gameforge a private company? probably not even big enough to be able to go public at all. And we don't even have to talk about Investor that invest into those public company. U can look through the Financial statement yourself.

and if you compare KR to Gameforge? it's also completely different balls game,

http://investors.lionsgate.com…ts/2017-annual-report.pdf

This is lionsgate annual report, that's why korean has a better event and so on, since liongate is huge. But gameforge is just a publisher and you expect a publisher to become a developer. If they are big enough to do whatever they want, they wouldnt be publisher, they will become developer themselves.A publisher is trying to make money in the same time try their best to meet their community needs, but they cant just meet community needs without thinking about their survival and people they have to pay and contract that they are bind to.

"Overall, it is much easier to invest in a publicly traded firm than a privately-held company. Public companies, especially larger ones, can easily be bought and sold on the stock market and, therefore, have superior liquidity and a quote market value. Conversely, it can be years before a private firm can again be sold and prices must be negotiated between the seller and buyer."

And Gameforge = Privately-held company, all other company you mentioned = Publicly traded firm.

And you mentioned why other company cares about community?

Investing in a public company may seem far superior to investing in a private one, but there are a handful of benefits to not being public. A major criticism of many public firms is that they are overly focused on quarterly results and meeting Wall Street analysts' short-term expectations. This can cause them to miss out on long-term value-creating opportunities, such as investing in a product that may take years to develop, hurting profits in the near term.

If they screw up, their investor will leave and cost them most lost and so on. Therefore, why those company u mentioned care so much about community. Not saying gameforge doesnt, just that they are limited by a lot other thing compare to publicly traded company.

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You completely missed my point, of course Digital Extremes, Blizzard, Square Enix are big companies right now and have a large amount of revenue, what i said was that they were not the titans that they are today, they started small and humble with little resources and your way of thinking sounds like what a corporate excutive would say "You don't have to enter a casino and gamble all your money is all optional", everything is optional, playing this game is optional, trying to justify your unethical stradegies to exploit your consumers is just plain manipulate and disgusting by using that line of defense just proves how much you care for yourself as a consumer.

Blizzard is guilty in this way of thinking too and when they might have found a balance between selling those lootboxes and keep upgrading their games but even then i won't support that way of thinking even if most of their community have agreed to have them in order to obtain more free content.

Warframe launch was received as a mediocre game at best and bad game at worst, yet the developers persisted and continue to improve and grow their game into becoming one of Steam top 10 most played games and has stayed there for a long time.

I know is not an apples to apples comparison and that GF doesn't develop the game however they do have control over the cash shop and can decide what and how much to sell their products to their consumers.

At the end of the day every company needs to make a profit thats their purpose after all, what i've tried to say in my previous post was that they don't need to neglect their own costumers in order to earn a profit and keep their buisness afloat they can obatain the right balance if they put enough effort into it.

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Fully agree with all your points. No real point arguing with short sighted people.

'Aurith Gods Random Box'

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